tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20173285.post203444706052984329..comments2024-03-28T21:21:02.777-04:00Comments on Divrei Chaim: ain m'arvin simcha b'simcha and sheva brachosChaim B.http://www.blogger.com/profile/02231811394447584320noreply@blogger.comBlogger7125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20173285.post-76036527447023947682011-12-02T14:24:38.716-05:002011-12-02T14:24:38.716-05:00>>> did you see the Brisker Rov inside? ...>>> did you see the Brisker Rov inside? <br /><br />inside? inside?? who sees inside? gaze waitfully into space,<br />okay, or expectantly out the window, maybe, but see inside?<br /><br />>>> ...which is one day <br /><br />how would "one day" make for <br />"[T]wo dinim in sheva brachos"(Rav Chaim), rather than one such din + a marriage day din? isn't his personal simcha at time other than "the critical moment of chassuna"? why doesn't his chiyuv to m'samei'ach the kallah itself pose a threat to Y"T joy (maybe he'll be successful with her joy, but not his own)? on whom is what chiyuv during the remaining 6 days of celebration?<br />...how can the Rambam's chosson's<br />multiple chiyuvs of personal simcha (1 per wife) mix with each other on day 1?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20173285.post-69147243069996045292011-12-02T00:28:48.574-05:002011-12-02T00:28:48.574-05:00Anonymous, did you see the Brisker Rov inside? Wh...Anonymous, did you see the Brisker Rov inside? Where he distinguishes the Chasan's obligation of personal simcha, which is one day and cannot be chal on yomtov, and his obligation to be m'samei'ach his kallah, which is unaffected by yomtov?bnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20173285.post-10074342011696358092011-12-01T17:32:43.517-05:002011-12-01T17:32:43.517-05:00thus ain m'arvin simcha b'simcha
must mean...thus ain m'arvin simcha b'simcha<br />must mean, that we don't interrupt<br />UNqualified joy-- yom tov & the last 6 days of sheva brachos are<br />unqualifiedly joyous, so neither<br />may be disturbed (by other, even lesser, joys); the day of marriage (the first day of the 7), is a Qualified joy-- the man undertakes responsibility then, to provide 3-ways for his wife, & the kesubah (while the woman, for her part, on that day loses either her father's house, or a certain degree of autonomy)--thus the immediate(day 1) joys of marriage to each of multiple wives--each a qualified joy--CAN mix with<br />each other, can be interrupted<br /><br />{sidenote: while we musn't mix two 6-day periods of (unqualified) joy, we may mix [G-d forbid], & thus lessen, 2 shiva periods of unqualified grief: Harachaman Hu!}Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20173285.post-8929867095152570892011-11-30T22:16:53.284-05:002011-11-30T22:16:53.284-05:00upon rereading, it's plain to see
that comment...upon rereading, it's plain to see<br />that comment 3 part 1 utterly fails<br />to convey the following points--<br />there's an implicit indication here<br />that All 7 days of sheva brachos <br />be celebrated "a week later" than<br />marriage on Y"T-- the day of the<br />chassuna would need to go uncounted, else the hava amina never starts (there would by definition be some degree of matrimonial joy competing with the<br />joy of Y"T); & of course, if uncounted, if the wedding itself be other than deliberate joy proper, then the shem chosson Should be chal... meanwhile, if the shem can"[N]ot fully take effect" "at the critical moment of<br />chassuna" because of rival joy, then Rambam's multiple wives operation falls apart, since it would mean multiple joys At The<br />Time of marriageAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20173285.post-2634476964954506582011-11-30T12:17:01.509-05:002011-11-30T12:17:01.509-05:00(never mind that the Rambam is saying one thing he...(never mind that the Rambam is saying one thing here & the Brisker Rav another,) would the failure to celebrate for 7 days invalidate the chassuna? of course<br />not! the shem chosson applies<br />independently of, & anterior to,<br />sheva brachos; the person is not<br />"getting" married, he already was!<br /><br />Rambam couples the 7 days of wedding celebration with the 7 days<br />of mourning, in his very first law<br />of avel; in the case of death on<br />Y"T, the latter are suspended until after Y"T-- shall one then<br />ask, but how can that be? the shem avel was never chal, as that would detract from the singular joy...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20173285.post-53561571608405740212011-11-30T01:12:53.889-05:002011-11-30T01:12:53.889-05:00It is the Ein me'arvin that prevents the shem ...It is the Ein me'arvin that prevents the shem chasan from being chal. <br /><br />By the way, in case your interested in the source for the din that if you finish the meal after shkiah that ends the seventh day that you do not go after the beginning of the seuda as one does by Shabbos and yomtov, it's here, <br />http://hebrewbooks.org/pdfpager.aspx?req=1640&st=&pgnum=38 which is the last paragraph of teshuva 28 in the Ginas Vradim, and he is pretty humdrum about it.Eliezer Eisenberghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16036989084122930226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20173285.post-43487667315327816592011-11-30T00:12:27.311-05:002011-11-30T00:12:27.311-05:00>>> answers
but Rambam gives ain m'a...>>> answers<br /><br />but Rambam gives ain m'arvin simcha b'simcha(Brisker Rav 2), not the weakened shem(B.R. 1), as the reason for his Y"T psak<br /><br />(if for two newly married couples,<br />4 people, at one sheva brachos, just a single set of blessings would be recited, then why not just<br />a single set for two couples, 3?)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com