tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20173285.post6076922825311483341..comments2024-03-25T09:43:27.402-04:00Comments on Divrei Chaim: ahavas chessed and hatzneya lechesChaim B.http://www.blogger.com/profile/02231811394447584320noreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20173285.post-80389988954435421682011-09-23T10:49:17.071-04:002011-09-23T10:49:17.071-04:00I agree completely with Chaim B. I think it is hig...I agree completely with Chaim B. I think it is high time we ask where is this type of chinuch taking us? I am one parent who thinks that the learning programs have too much excess, that too many teachers are using prizes as a crutch, and that the promotion of materialism is to our detriment. <br /><br />I also question whether or not the materialism (and all the man hours) are actually "efficient."Orthonomicshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07892074485262548496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20173285.post-26790250061422047732011-09-22T18:52:31.647-04:002011-09-22T18:52:31.647-04:00>>>Unfortunately, the mosdot are desperat...>>>Unfortunately, the mosdot are desperate, and it seems only these materialistic enticements will bring in the big bucks.<br /><br />Well, if all that matters is getting the $ and the heck with our values, why not just steal the money?<br />..Oh, on second thought I think that one may have been tried by a few institutions as well ; )<br /><br />At least part of the reason why appeals to kavod or other nonsense works (aside from the fact that the yetzer ha'ra is very powerful) is because we are never taught that this is a bad thing -- the chinuch system perpetuates the problem. A child motivated by materialism becomes an adult who can only be motivated by greater appeals to materialism.Chaim B.https://www.blogger.com/profile/02231811394447584320noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20173285.post-10454254124111097782011-09-22T13:05:47.435-04:002011-09-22T13:05:47.435-04:00@Michael Mirsky I understand what you're sayin...@Michael Mirsky I understand what you're saying, but this is the school that is meant to educate the girls into Torah true values. It should not descend into pushing them to bid on prizes to gain a few hundred $ more. That is where the excess money would go.Ariella's bloghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09409352047101582583noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20173285.post-47268802968132990942011-09-22T13:00:03.962-04:002011-09-22T13:00:03.962-04:00@Tal, Unlike in a Chinese auction, the prizes the ...@Tal, Unlike in a Chinese auction, the prizes the girls bid on here are not donated. That's why the Shabbos in New Square price started at $100 per person. They have to cover the hotel and transportation costs.Ariella's bloghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09409352047101582583noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20173285.post-22267444818498762272011-09-22T12:58:57.884-04:002011-09-22T12:58:57.884-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.Ariella's bloghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09409352047101582583noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20173285.post-48706528842349141972011-09-22T12:57:47.351-04:002011-09-22T12:57:47.351-04:00It just goes to show, you don't have to live i...It just goes to show, you don't have to live in Lakewood to live a Lakewood style life. You can even pull it off in the 5 Towns. It's not the makom that is gorem, but the person. <br /><br />This is all a sign of the fact that nobody seems to know what to do with girls. For boys, the answer is always "learn Torah." For girls it is ... do chessed? think about tznius? Whatever, they don't have a clear direction, and this monstrous hybrids of chesed projects with materialistic consumption on top for the fun factor is the result.<br /><br />For the boys, there was an auction on Simchas Torah for a kibbud and winning a dance with the head of the yeshiva. They bid either hours or blatt learned. That wouldn't go over in the girls' school. They could have them bid extra hours of chesed, I suppose, but then you may have a problem of making a vow that will not be fulfilled.Ariella's bloghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09409352047101582583noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20173285.post-24380922444969791142011-09-22T11:58:47.483-04:002011-09-22T11:58:47.483-04:00Then I too have the sensibilities of a Lakewood Ye...Then I too have the sensibilities of a Lakewood Yeshiva person also. . . .Orthonomicshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07892074485262548496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20173285.post-66701013248044139962011-09-21T22:15:30.357-04:002011-09-21T22:15:30.357-04:00In December of '05, the BMG Ladies Auxiliary s...In December of '05, the BMG Ladies Auxiliary sent out a Chinese Auction booklet that offered prizes thatwere, by Lakewood standards, extravagant. Rabbi Kotler soon retracted the booklet and issued an apology. Chaim, you have the sensibilities of a Lakewood Yeshiva person. For the rest of us, the reality is that this is a good and efficient way to raise money.bnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20173285.post-19211287660227605042011-09-21T21:58:40.670-04:002011-09-21T21:58:40.670-04:00Correct me if I am wrong, but usually the prizes i...Correct me if I am wrong, but usually the prizes in such events are DONATED by someone (usually a commerical entity looking for some good will). So perhaps your daughter should re-check the facts.<br /><br />As for appealing to materialism to elicit tseddakah, yes it very unfortunate. But there are other appeals to the yetzer harah done for the same purpose. How about auctioning off aliyos to the highest bidder -- including <i>pesichah by neilah</i>. Or naming institutions (or subparts thereof) after a donor? Not an appeal to kavod?Tal Benscharnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20173285.post-44836613133316051112011-09-21T21:36:06.067-04:002011-09-21T21:36:06.067-04:00Similar to the glitsy Chinese auctions a well-know...Similar to the glitsy Chinese auctions a well-known kiruv organization runs.<br /><br />Unfortunately, the mosdot are desperate, and it seems only these materialistic enticements will bring in the big bucks.Michael Mirskynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20173285.post-50110229176182529332011-09-21T19:55:06.970-04:002011-09-21T19:55:06.970-04:00I'm glad I managed to tone it down - I didn...I'm glad I managed to tone it down - I didn't want to be a ba'al lashon ha'ra even without naming the school.Chaim B.https://www.blogger.com/profile/02231811394447584320noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20173285.post-47250632680282515522011-09-21T19:44:41.910-04:002011-09-21T19:44:41.910-04:00First of all, I didn't sense any harshness and...First of all, I didn't sense any harshness and frankly, kol hakavod to your daughter for having the maturity to reject gross materialism even when presented in the guise of chesed.<br />On Purim there are two "ben adam l'chevero" mitzvos - matanos l'evyonim and giving gifts one to another. But the gifts are basic, a couple of items of food. Does this not suggest that while one can enjoy one's earnings a bit, one must still keep the poor and needy in mind and not use them as an excuse to lord it up?Garnel Ironheartnoreply@blogger.com